SALES DATA FOR IDOLS

You've got to remember she's a country artist. Country music is completely different in every way. Fans are extremely passionate about their favorite artists more so than most of the other genres combined. They are one of the few fan bases that actually go out and BUY the music no matter what. The country music family is a very tight knit group.

I know all that, but still. Millions and millions in sales is impressive. Not saying Carrie isn't deserving because she is. Simon certainly called it right with her.

Besides her awesome voice they get the best kick ass country writers for her. Her singles are sooooo radio friendly and many with crossover appeal.

All very true FC! She gets the best of the best.

Anybody that can sell that many albums will get the best and it will be money well spent. Carrie seems to have done everything right. She went right to the top without a hitch, and she worked very hard at it. The record company knew what as asset it had with Carrie and off she went.

This is Singles info. Adam's WWFM has moved up to #10 of all time Idol singles sales! Interestingly Clay is only on the chart once. Why no TITN?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Idol_alumni_single_sales

Clay is on there twice. Solitaire 322,000 and Invisible around 100,000. But no TITN. The entire chart is dominated by Carrie Underwood, with a few other Idolsl sprinkled about. I'm surprised Jordin is #1.

Just wait a few years. Adam will be all over that chart.

I totally believe the reason that song was so HUGE was because of Chris Brown. He was soooooooooo popular at that time. Still would have been had he not beaten up Riri.

Idols sales:

Fantasia, Back to Me (9,000, -14%, 282,000 total) (#46 Billboard 200)
Carrie Underwood, Play On (6,000, -5%, 1.768 million) (#69 BB200)
Daughtry, Leave This Town (4,000, -2%, 1.171 million) (#98 BB200)
David Archuleta, The Other Side of Down (4,000, -38%, 34,000) (#125 BB200)
Adam Lambert, For Your Entertainment (3,000, -3%, 746,000) (#187 BB200)
Mandisa, Freedom (1,000, -31%, 126,000)
Danny Gokey, My Best Days (less than 1,000, -11%, 189,000)
Chris Sligh, The Anatomy of Broken (less than 1,000,+63%, 3,000)

Archie's new CD is not doing well at all. It will be interesting to see what happens when David Cook finally gets his sophomore CD out. Looks like it will be awhile as the label has sent him back to the drawing board for a third time...

'Tasia is doing fairly well. I was watching Fantasia for Real last week. I must have been really bored. Anyway, remember that stuff about how she couldn't read? In the episode, she was studying for her GED. She was reading and writing answers on the test. She got the highest score in the class on her GED. She just makes up stories to make people feel sorry for her and how far she has come.

Back to the drawing board for the third time? Just what the heck does he have to do to get his music out there? That is honestly disappointing not just for the fans but for him and the band especially.

teddyhugz wrote:

Back to the drawing board for the third time? Just what the heck does he have to do to get his music out there? That is honestly disappointing not just for the fans but for him and the band especially.

Something needs to happen soon cause many many fans of David Cooks are on a hate Adam Lambert Kick,(I found out about this a little bit on Adam Online). They are feeling like RCA is shoving David Cook over so they can put all their efforts into Adam for US and International stuff. I don't think they are doing this but RCA when it had Clive Davis hooked to them has totally ignored AI people before to the point where their cd got no promotion,(Diana Degarmo is that person. Clive was too busy trying to make Fantasia huge,( Tasia was with another label but it was a label that Clive was part of also), so he made Diana fend for herself). So knowing RCA has screwed up before I can kind of see why David Cook fans are mad at them even though I do not believe they are pushing him aside for Adam. I want David to succeed badly on his second cd and it makes me sad that he has been told to start all over again.

ETA: I am so sad about David Archuleta's sales #'s :( Damn Jive do your freaking job. Any of the idols that are with Jive I feel so bad for. Kris, David, Jordin and Crystal I am praying for ya. I do not want any of you hurt like Alli was!!

Shannon

Sometimes everything is not the fault of the label. The label exists to make money, and of course they promote most highly the ones they think will do that. Fantasia seemed a better bet than Diana, no matter how nice a person Diana may be. Right now, Adam is hotter than Cook, so Adam gets more label attention. It is important that Cook's next album be a very good one. Otherwise, he goes the way of most Idols. So the label has to be careful to get it right, and I consider their careful approach to be a sign that they have faith in Cook and don't want to screw it up.

Sorry to rant, but blaming the label seems to push my buttons. (Probably because that's all you hear in the Clay world). It is not the label's objective to give all Idols a fair chance, because not all Idols are good enough. Or their image sucks, or whatever. I'm sure the label has ways of measuring how a cd will sell, and they are not going to spend a lot of money if they don't believe it is going anywhere. They pick and choose. Of course they do. Sure the label can make mistakes, but the harsh truth is that there are only a handful of Idols, out of the hundreds, who will make it with out without promotion. It's not about hurting people. It's about a very tough business where the stakes are high and chances of success low.

Thank you Spirit! I 100% agree with you. Just figured I'd keep my mouth shut on this one as my opinions just piss people off anyway.

I hope nobody gets pissed off, even if they don't agree. This board is different that way. We don't jump on each other (very often).

Well, I enjoy a good "back and forth" discussion but it appears others do not. I wish though..... it was my purpose for the board. Good discussions/good debates. Voiceing all opinions.

Labels are in the business to make money. They will push who they feel will get them the best return.

I agree with you both, it is not realistic to blame the labels for all the ills of some of this people in the music business.

The reality is some just don't have what it takes to be very successful.

I remember Elliott Yamin saying that just because millions of people vote for you every week on AI, it doesn't mean they are going to go out and spend money on a cd or concert. It's the label's business to know which artists people do want to spend money to hear.

Spirit wrote:

Sometimes everything is not the fault of the label. The label exists to make money, and of course they promote most highly the ones they think will do that.

Sorry to rant, but blaming the label seems to push my buttons. (Probably because that's all you hear in the Clay world). It is not the label's objective to give all Idols a fair chance, because not all Idols are good enough. Or their image sucks, or whatever. I'm sure the label has ways of measuring how a cd will sell, and they are not going to spend a lot of money if they don't believe it is going anywhere. They pick and choose. Of course they do. Sure the label can make mistakes, but the harsh truth is that there are only a handful of Idols, out of the hundreds, who will make it with out without promotion. It's not about hurting people. It's about a very tough business where the stakes are high and chances of success low.

Spirit blaming the label is a big thing right now cause many of them have been screwing up especially when it does come to the the idols. From Day one with Kelly they have been held this unholy higher level that is so unfair. The idols cause of the show are expected to sell better than any other artist. No body ever realizes that even though people vote for the people on idol doesn't mean they are going to go out and buy the merchandise from these people if they get to be winner or get to the point of being signed to a label. There are sooooooooooooooooooooo many people that just look at AI as a TOTAL REALITY SHOW and are only doing the voting for the show itself and not thinking about it after the fact. I know at least a dozen people who watch and vote but have never bought one of the cd's. The labels should look at the people from AI just like brand new artist and give them a real chance and that means really really supporting them and putting in the effort to promote them no matter what.

One Label that has been under fire for a couple of years now is JIVE. Jive has always been Frugal and that is honestly fine but they have been going way too far. They have gone so way off they lost one of the top acts in the business. Backstreet Boys can sell out concerts like nobody but for the last two cd's of theirs Jive had done nothing to promote them and I mean nothing. They got fed up and lefts Jive. Jive has four idols alums but had five. I won't talk about the stuff going on with Crystal because she is creating problems for herself with them so in away she is digging her own grave. The others it is different. Jordin and David A. are the two that have been with them the longest and both have second cd's that have not done well even though they are really good. I saw no promotion from jive for either of them anywhere. Their Management got them the gigs they did. I will give jive the credit for getting Battlefield played on the radio but her other singles got none. For David A. they put out his first single and even made a video and fans had been asking when they could start calling to request for both and it never came. Next time people looked Jive has put out another song and just kind of dropped the first single without any word not even to David. David always lets his fans know what is up so they can help with the song and stuff and he never came out and said anything that the label decided to change things up. *For Kris Jive has been all kinds of wrong in many many many ways. The second single they picked was not the right choice and even before it was put out they were told this. People who were not even fans came out on Kris's site that was asking for info on their choice. Jive was told that The Truth is a beautiful song but was not a good choice for a single especially a single for the summer since it is a sad song. They were also told that putting Pat on it and pretty much taking Kris's best part of the song was a wrong idea and people wouldn't like it or buy it. People also told them that the better single to put out especially for Summer was "Alright With Me". Jive did not listen they put out "The Truth" with Pat included in it and it pretty much tanked. They put it out much too late after the first single, they screwed up big time and waited many months after the single was out to get a video made and then put out and then they and VH1 pulled the video just a little after it got on VH1 and was actually doing some good. When it was pulled the song was on its own again with no promotion of any kind except Kris singing it on tour and once on Idol. Even when it started to slide more their was no word on a third single. Just last week or the week before Kris got a call from someone saying he would get a third single and oh my it just turns out to be the song that should of been the second single. Alright With Me. Is the new single and almost two weeks went by before Jive put out word that they were releasing that as the single. When Kris was aloud to tell people should of been the day that Jive told people so the stations would get the song and playing it a few times to get a feel for it. the last few days it finally getting a few ADDS on radio even though we have no official ADD date. The song is getting good buzz cause the people who said this should of been the second song are doing all they can to make this work cause Alright With Me is a great song. This is really not the right season for it cause Summer really was the best season to have it out but people believe in the song and will do what they can to make it succeed. Now that the single has been picked and is out Jive should be on the ball trying to get a video made. Kris is not even in the know if there is going to be a video. They keep him in the dark. Yes Kris is busy so fitting in something is hard but there is a window in his routine right now that a video could be made. Jive should be promoting Alright With Me right now but the person or persons promoting it are Kris, His fans and his relatives and friends on Twitter. They are putting the phrase Alright With Me into things they say so that the name is constantly out there and on peoples minds. Jive just has been incompitant,(sp?) when it comes to Kris. *With Allison ugh don't get me started. Alli is so talented but they made the wrong moves with her from day one of with a horrible release date, putting out the wrong single for a first one and then when she gets good ones not doing anything to promote them. I know so many people that didn't even realize she had stuff out. Also it is the labels job to make sure the cd's are stocked in the stores. In my area In three or four stores there was not one Allison cd in stock for months and months even before she was dropped. how can people go out and buy a cd that is not there. In these same stores I haven't seen Kris's either and I ask about them so the store knows that they are out of stock. The label needs to help these artist even if they are ones that have been seen on the show. They are supposed to promote them but when it comes to the idols they drop them before they even get a shot. If they were a new artist they would get a chance. Jodee Messina is a country artist with Curb records her first cd which I thought was really good tanked and I mean tanked sooooooooo badly. If she was an idol she probably would of been dropped but nope she was not she got to take some time and really work on her second cd. When they put it out with two amazing singles it shot up and sold like hot cakes. I believe that and the singles went Platinum or Double Platinum for the cd and the singles I believe went Platinum. Jodee has like 6 or 7 cd's now and most of them are gold and platinum selling. Tim Mcgraw,(sp?),,(her producer) and Curb fostered her talent and put faith in her even though the first cd did badly; they didn't jump the gun and drop her. Labels won't even think of doing that now. You sell big right out of the gate as an idol or you could be dropped. I saw someone say that Tasia was a better bet than Diana at the time. The thing with them is Tasia was not with RCA she was with another label that Clive worked with Diana was with RCA. Diana deserved the attention to get things right. She has a good first cd and they handled it really really badly cause Clive who was working with both of them never took the time with Diana that he did with Tasia. Clive didn't get demoted for nothing; he was doing many many things wrong and a lot of it had to do with the idols especially Kelly. Anyway with Diana they never even put out a single for her first cd till the day her cd dropped into the stores. There was no promotion for the cd at all. she was on two shows the day the cd was dropped but then it was like a month later that they had her on shows to promote the single. Nothing ever took off because there was so much time in between things and also there was no video at all. Arista did the same with Taylor. They never promoted the cd and never even really put out singles for him and gave him no videos. Luckily Diana and Taylor were able to get out their contracts before they were dropped. People think they were dropped but they weren't with Diana all knew they were not putting anything into her and the dropping of her had the writing on the wall so her mom got her lawyer to get Diana out of the contract before they could drop her. Taylor and Arista has a mutual split. They did not fight Taylor when he asked to get out of his contract. He is now owner of his own label where he gets to do his music not stuff that is forced on him, and he gets to put stuff out and any money made from it pretty much goes back to him in his label.. Anyways Diana was never given a chance to succeed with RCA cause they never even tried with her. The girl has a killer set of pipes and if they would of handled her right she could of been huge like Taylor Swift. Diana is totally lucky she is sooooooooooo talented cause while she is working on her country music she has an extremely awesome second career which has her being in musicals and plays. She is becoming the little broadway baby and getting rave reviews all around that area. Diana has talent coming out of her ears and she has done nothing like Tasia to get attention. Diana deserved more than she got and she got screwed from RCA plain and simple. Tasia is using gimmicks and making people feel for her to get all she has. Everybody falls for her acts and it makes me so mad.

ETA: Kristy Lee Cook is another I will mention. The label signed her rushed out a cd for her and never promoted it. They dropped her like a month or so after they released the cd. How are people supposed to go buy a cd they don't even know is out?????? Kristy deserved a chance to succeed but she wasn't given it. She is now signed to a new label and hoping she will get a real chance to shine. Oh two other people That I should mention. Bo and Blake. Both were with RCA and neither got the promotion for their first cd's. Both got dropped. I believe both are with different labels now and have got far more promotion with the ones they are with then they ever got with RCA. With Blake I had heard their was some conflicts with him so like Clay it could of been a thing where RCA didn't want to put up with the crap from Blake and in that area I can understand just getting rid of the problem.

Okay sorry for the book the labels should not be let off the hook here many times they have screwed up when it comes to the idols and I am not talking about RCA with Clay. I believe things went sour with that and Clay got in trouble with them. If the labels are going to sign the artist they should put some effort into helping that artist. If they aren't going to do anything for them then don't even sign them to the contract. Jive to me is the worst label right now. The only artist on their docket they ever really put anything into as far as promotion and everything is Britany Spears. She is their girl and they will shove all others aside so they can bow down to Brit.

ETA: Also one other thing with Diana. She from the start was should of been singing Country but Clive Davis told her to sing the songs she was given and even though I loved her cd it was not the right path. David Foster worked with Diana on her first cd and the song he did with her ended up being the best song on the cd. That song was the only song that Clive did not pick for her and one she actually did pick. Anyway David heard all the songs from the demo she did and he told her straight out that these were the wrong songs for her. That she should be doing something else. Diana agreed with David but of course Diana never said anything to Clive cause she is One respectful and Two was only 16 and didn't think anybody would listen to her. Clive for years has put what he feels the people from Idol should be singing. he did it with Taylor,,(his cd did SELL ALMOST Platinum but just think if it would of been songs that were actually Taylor type instead of songs forced on him to sing and if he would of got some promotion how his sales would of been. Many of the fans that loved him from hearing his self made cd's would of bought the first cd if it would of been like the self made ones), and Bo also and that turned out wrong also. He tries to pigion hole them into what he thinks people want to here. Now that Clive has been demoted the idols have had a little more control over their own sound and what they want to sing and that is one area I will give the label credit. They are at least trying to let the idols be who they really are.

Shannon

You may well be right about all that, Shannon. I don't know that much about the music industry and haven't followed anybody except Clay and now Adam. I'm sure all labels have their share of buttholes wearing suits and I'm sure they do make mistakes about which artists to promote. It is a complicated business as well as a difficult one, and sometimes a crystal ball would help quite a bit.

The Clay situation is what lingers in my mind. Clay was never held responsible (by his fans) for anything.
Big Bad Clive or RCA was out to destroy his career.
I don't know what went on with Clay and RCA, but I do know that no label is out to destroy any of their artists. I'm sure they would like nothing better than to repeat the success of MOAM. Who knows why Clay's sales went into steep decline, but for sure it was not an RCA conspiracy. I just got sick of hearing crap like that when a lot of it was Clay's own darn fault. It went on for years, and still goes on probably.

As for promotion, I believe the label do promote every album to some extent. I knew about Kristy Lee's cd and I remember the cover and I certainly never followed her. Promotion is done cautiously, so if sales are not promising after a time, the label doesn't waste its money. They cannot force people to buy no matter how much promotion they do. Fans follow their favorites, and they know when a cd comes out. Lots of fans means a lot of initial sales. If that isn't forthcoming, well, the label loses interest.

Well, I don't have time to read a novel this morning - but again I agree 100% with Spirit.

Labels don't want to destroy people. If it's not working out they can just drop them. They do not need to actively destroy people.

I feel there are many reasons Clay's sales are in the toilet. The music he chooses to record is the main reason. I do think he got a big head back in 2004 and was stubborn and headbutted the wrong people. Just one of his mistakes.

Ouch!

Firecracker wrote:

Well, I don't have time to read a novel this morning - but again I agree 100% with Spirit.

Labels don't want to destroy people. If it's not working out they can just drop them. They do not need to actively destroy people.

I feel there are many reasons Clay's sales are in the toilet. The music he chooses to record is the main reason. I do think he got a big head back in 2004 and was stubborn and headbutted the wrong people. Just one of his mistakes.

We have to remember one of the cd's Clay did do was not of his choice. The covers cd for RCA was all Clives idea. I loved that cd by the way so I had no problem with it. Also I have liked All of Clay's cd's so none are a problem for me.

I wrote in my last post that I really wouldn't go into the Clay situation cause I know something went down. I know Clay can have a chip on his shoulders and I also know he can get snarky and snippy fast so I have no doubt he ruffled feathers and that probably caused a huge riffed between him and the suits at RCA. Oh I also said that the stuff going on with Crystal and Jive is for the most part her fault since she has all this drama going on. She is digging her own grave and whatever happens she will have to accept!

Labels may not be out to destroy an artist but I really don't believe they are in for helping all their artist. As I said in my last post if a label really doesn't want the particular artist cause they really don't have the faith that they can make the money then don't even sign them. It would save a lot of stress and heartache for all involved.

Shannon